iCandy Duo Podcast

Hypnobirthing with The Positive Birth Company

December 22, 2020 iCandy World Season 1 Episode 1
iCandy Duo Podcast
Hypnobirthing with The Positive Birth Company
Show Notes Transcript

Siobhan Miller, Founder of The Positive Birth Company, talks to the iCandy Duo Podcast about making hypnobirthing accessible for all.

Speaker 1:

Hello and welcome to the eye-candy duo podcast. I'm your host Naomi Williams. This podcast is brought to you by, I can be world makers of beautifully British pushchairs for parents across the globe.

Speaker 2:

[inaudible] hello and welcome

Speaker 1:

To the first ever. I can't eat you. Opencast. We are talking this week with shovel Miller, the founder of the positive birth company. She born at her team. I've been on a mission to make hypnobirthing accessible for all committed to empowering women around the world and their birth partners to create positive birth experiences and supporting women in pregnancy birth and beyond. Hi Shavon. It's so lovely to meet you and thank you so much for joining us on the[inaudible] podcast. How are you doing today?

Speaker 3:

I'm good. Thank you. Thanks so much for having me.

Speaker 1:

Fantastic. And how are you? Um, how are you guys doing, obviously COVID pandemic, it's been a bit of a challenging, strange time for us all. How, how are the guys at the positive birth company

Speaker 3:

Doing? Yeah, well at the minute, um, we're self isolating, so not so great, but, um, so I'm just home alone at the minute and have been philosophy 12 days, but, uh, looking forward to being able to, um, go out again into the world.

Speaker 1:

I, I know it's going to be an extraordinary thing to even think it's a strange time even going to the supermarket feels like kind of almost like a weekend trip to Venice at the moment. So I'm going to run down the street

Speaker 4:

Like I'm through because,

Speaker 1:

Um, with the, the positive birth company, um, yeah, I've seen him, obviously you guys do a lot of sort of digital online courses and stuff. So I guess you're quite equipped for this period, but just for some of our listeners that might not be totally familiar with what you guys do. Um, could you just kind of give us a quick summary of what, you know, what the positive birth company is?

Speaker 3:

Sure. So, um, what we are now is a company on a mission to make antenatal and postnatal education and support more accessible for everyone. Um, what we started out initially with, as a hit offering hypnobirthing classes, um, initially that was face-to-face hypnobirthing classes, you kind of standard anti-natal class, where you go to a venue and sit with the teacher and other couples. Um, then in 2018 we launched our online program, which is the digital pack, um, and that really took off and that's all online. Um, and then from there we developed a postnatal course and various other bits and pieces. So we've kind of evolved over time. So yeah, we were, um, very much a digital company even before COVID happened. Um, most of our courses were offered online

Speaker 1:

By fan. Fantastic. Because obviously like you guys had a crystal ball over, coming up with the situation we're in now, but when you first started kind of, um, you know, like you say about the hypnobirthing classes and stuff like that, what was the ultimate kind of goal? Did you ever imagine it would become what it is today?

Speaker 3:

I had no idea. I've no idea it would become what it is today. Um, but my goal was to make it more accessible because I found it deeply unfair that you had to have quite a lot of disposable income to be able to afford private hypnobirthing classes. And just from my own experience when I had my first son, that wasn't something that was available to me. So I actually went into labor in know quite yeah, uninformed and quite naive, and therefore had quite a difficult and labor and induction. Um, my son was born in theater after two days of induced labor and it wasn't, it wasn't by any means a positive or empowering experience. And then fast forward seven years when I was having my second son, I was able to do a hypnobirthing course and that really changed everything for me. Um, it changed how I felt in my pregnancy. My birth was the most amazing day of my life. Um, and my postnatal period as a result was a lot happier, more positive experience as well. So it really offered me a huge amount of benefits. And so when I trained to become a hypnobirthing teacher, my kind of key objective was to every woman should be able to access this birth education and have the opportunity of a really positive and empowering experience, which for me comes down to having the access to that education in the first place. So that was always sort of our, our goal was to make, um, birth education, more accessible for everyone.

Speaker 1:

That's incredible. And actually just, you know, to be able to lean into your own obviously personal experience, um, is, is such a kind of an impetus to start such a thing and be able to, like you say, kind of pass on the knowledge that you have. And it's, it's crazy actually considering, you know, you're just saying, oh, you know, your first birth was, you were two days in labor. I don't think anything like that would happen. Like not knock the wind out of me hearing that, but I know it's such a familiar thing I know from my own friends and stuff, like, you know, that's almost becomes part of almost like this unspoken, um, truth about birth, where it's, uh, it's fascinating to know that actually, like you say, it can actually be quite empowering and, um, you know, it can be an absolutely amazing experience, uh, labor. It doesn't have to be this terrifying thought. Um, so, you know, when you say hypnobirthing from what you, what you'd say about, you know, your first labor experience, how did it, how did it help? Like what actually does hypnobirthing mean?

Speaker 3:

Sure. So, um, hypnobirthing really is just a form of antenatal education and the Hypnos element puts people off I think, or makes them think it's a bit woo, which is a shame because actually hypnobirthing is really quite scientific and based in an understanding of the physiology of your body and your psychology, the of birth, essentially. So it is quite scientific, which I think surprises people, but also gets all of the kind of skeptics on board as well. So when I went along to the hypnobirthing course, when I was pregnant, you know, first off we learn about how the muscles of the body work and labor, how the hormones you produce actually influence how the muscles work. And once I even understood just the basics of the mechanics behind birth, I really was able to understand better what had happened to me the first time and what I could do differently the second time. So it was hugely insightful, uh, before I even got to giving birth, again, just understanding what had happened to me before, um, was just, yeah, really huge in terms of overcoming any fear that I had, because I thought actually I know more and can do more. So the first sort of part of a hypnobirthing course is always the science. Then you learn lots and lots of relaxation techniques. Um, and those relaxation techniques include breathing and massage and mindfulness techniques. And I always say they're life skills because they're things that you can use for the rest of your life. Any time you feel anxious or worried, or, um, yeah. Prehensile or overwhelmed any of those emotions. But, um, you, you learn these relaxation tools that when you go into labor, you are able to be calm and relaxed and produce oxytocin, which is the hormone that actually fuels those searches or those contractions. So it is actually very scientific contrary to what it sounds like.

Speaker 1:

And I have to say, cause I even just from, you know, you know, looking on the website and just kind of familiarizing myself with it, because like you said, I think the word hypnosis can seem a little bit too holistic or it might seem kind of, no, if you're having an, I say there's some do a quote unquote thing with my hands had an easy or straightforward birth. And the thing that really surprised me is, you know, you've got examples of women that they've applied this technique and they've had twins and it isn't just necessarily a homebirth scenario it's oh, no, this is where the midwife, this was in hospital. It's, you know, I was quite surprised by the number of ways that you can apply this in various.

Speaker 3:

Yes, it's a really common misconception that hypnobirthing is just for people having home or two births, you know, kind of really, um, intervention, free, straightforward birth. But I honestly believe it's more important to have done a hypnobirthing course when your birth is actually more challenging because when things are easy and straightforward, you might not even need to use half of what you've learned. But actually when things are more challenging, like if you're navigating an induction and different decisions, hypnobirthing is going to really help you because those times can be quite stressful. So one, you have the tools, the practical tools you can use to actually, you know, um, feel calm and relaxed. Secondly, we teach a framework to help you make informed decisions. So again, really useful in those scenarios. And essentially when you're making an informed choice, even if it wasn't what you originally hoped for, but at least you understand the options. It's your choice. You feel it's the best route for you and your baby. You're going to feel a lot more positive about that pathway compared to, if you feel very out of control, you're being told what to do. You don't really understand why, and you end up going down a path where perhaps there's a lot of intervention and you don't understand why. And that's what can leave a lot of women feeling very traumatized by their birth experience. So it's really important that people feel informed and respected and listened to and in control and hypnobirthing really gives people the tools and techniques to enable them to be in that position.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. I find that because it just listening to you and actually you're so right. You know, as, um, as a woman, I don't have any children, but there isn't, you know, when I think about my own professional life, there, isn't really a scenario where I would say go into a meeting and be, you know, maybe only half aware of what I was going into. And do you see what I mean, it's almost the same sort of application. And I think there's quite a fascination where there are so like, we, we were talking previously, like I have, I've got a number of different friends and I think that maybe one in every, I dunno, 20 have said, oh yeah, you know, straight in, straight out or three hours, you know, easy peasy kind of thing. Um, everyone has a kind of, a bit of a journey with, with birth and which is to be expected, you know, it's, it's quite, it's quite an event, you know, it's not going to be necessarily so straightforward. Um, and it's, I think it's actually just, like you say, just being totally kind of, uh, in charge of your opinions, no matter what, what happens and what kind of gets thrown at you. Um, and it is kind of a, kind of a strange scenario where that may be because of the medical background and things that we're kind of so been taught, we would not necessarily have, we, wouldn't not want to go in with all those opinions. So it's really interesting to kind of, you know, like you say, just to army yourself and just so you're just informed really. And so you can keep that calm.

Speaker 3:

She always say knowledge is power. You know, the more, you know, the better equipped you are to navigate your birth experience because, you know, we can't guarantee what birth is going to go. Like, you know, it can pan out in various ways, but at least if you're prepared for all the different pathways, um, you're in a really good, strong position. Um, and I think as well, just culturally, you know, you sort of touched on it, but, um, you know, we're very much conditioned. The little that we do know growing up is that birth is meant to be scary or traumatic. You know, whenever we see images of birth or depictions of birth on TV, or, you know, we just hear stories and stuff. You know, what we do know is actually very negative typically. So a lot of hypnobirthing is trying to kind of undo that and actually build new positive associations with birth, through listening to affirmations or reading positive birth stories or watching positive birth videos instead of ones that have been kind of fictional births for which aren't really reflective of what your average birth would look like. And actually overcoming that fear because it's the fear that means you're more likely to produce adrenaline, which has quite a negative impact when it, when you're in labor on actually how your muscles are able to work. So a lot of hypnobirthing is about overcoming that kind of fear that we have potentially ingrained within us about birth and feeling more positive in pregnancy and more confident as well.

Speaker 1:

That's incredible. And it must have a very positive impact as well with, you know, with your, with your birth partner, you know, who's coming in to join you on that journey. Um, is it like, is there an extension for partners as well, or is it something where you've found, you know, because you know, the women that are going through this process, they feel so much calmer and so much more prepared that is having such a, it has a positive impact on the partners as well.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. And not just through that, not just, it's more positive for the partners because the mother herself is feeling calm, but actually on a hypnobirthing course, birth partners learn what they can do to support the birth process and play an active and supportive role. And that's generally a lot better than feeling completely like a lemon in the room and not knowing how to help and feeling out of control. And it's the outer control feeling that often is what makes a birth experience quite traumatic is feeling completely out of control. And that can happen to birth partners as well. So when a birth partner comes on a hypnobirthing course and learns about what to expect and comes away essentially with a big to-do list of the things that they are responsible for from kind of setting the scene to know timing, the surge is initially to supporting and coaching mum through each surge, helping her to relax in between. I teach me like the traffic light system. Um, and essentially they have a whole toolkit that they can use to support mom through the experience they feel, yes, it's a million times more positive for them because they feel that they're part of it and they know what they're doing. So, yeah, it's, it's great for birth partners as well.

Speaker 1:

I have to say, when you were talking about, um, partners, especially, you know, when things are kind of developing and that, you know, there's that, that sense of, um, losing control, I'm actually sat next to David. Who's the father of two, and I can see him nodding nodding away. Cause it must be, yeah, if you, you know, it must be a terrifying feeling, but w you know, this is someone you love about to have someone you're about to love as well. Um, and if you know, the situation's developing and you don't feel like you're equipped to step in and be able to help, it must be terrifying, you know, no shorter word. And I'm guessing, um, especially at the moment, I mean, it's, you know, it's been in the back of my mind, you know, for a lot of pregnant women out there at the moment during this pandemic. Um, and there's a lots of things going on in the news about can, you know, partners going into scans or not, and all this kind of stuff. I mean, um, how are you, how are you finding this period with the customers and the people that are coming to you for, for help?

Speaker 3:

Yes, it's obviously a lot of worry, especially initially at the beginning, a lot of worry and anxiety about giving birth alone. And indeed we have had some women who have given birth alone and we've shared their stories on our social media, and they have had positive experiences, but, you know, it's not ideal. Nobody wants to give birth alone, but the, you know, the rules have been throughout the whole of the time that as long as your birth partner, isn't symptomatic, that they should be with you when you were giving birth. So that's been, you know, it's never been that birth partners shouldn't be with the mum when she's giving birth, but there has been restrictions around birth partners on the antenatal and postnatal wards. Um, and that was to kind of keep numbers down essentially. So that on the wards, there would be the women and the NHS staff. So what that's meant for birth partners and mothers is that if they've gone into labor and gone in early, or they've been induced for, therefore they've been on that anti-natal ward, they haven't had their birth partner with them for that period of time. Then once they were in established labor and they move to the delivery suite or the labor ward, then their birth partner would be able to join them. But yes, there's been lots of women and still indeed in hospitals at the moment where they might be experiencing that early labor or an induction without their birth partner. And that obviously is not ideal. And it is very, very hard.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, no, absolutely. But I suppose the whole very basis of hypnobirthing gives them at least the tools to kind of, you know, you know, deal with that, um, that, that separation,

Speaker 3:

I have an app that we've created called Frayer, which we didn't create in response to COVID that was launched before, but it's actually really useful. Now it's a virtual birth partner. So the app is on the app store and Google play store it's called Frayer. And essentially that kind of, it will never replace the real life birth partner. But what it does is every time you press the button to let it know that you're having, um, a surge or a contraction, the audio will actually count for you to count you through your breathing technique and play a little kind of visual that's in sync with the breathing. So you can focus on that visual if you want. And then in between it plays positive affirmations, which are really reassuring and encouraging. It plays music, and you can sync it to your Spotify playlist, and it also plays guided meditations. So you can, and it also tracks your searches and keeps track of them in a log. So you can know how kind of frequently they're coming and how long they're lasting. So it will do a lot of jobs of the birth partner if women or women asked for tips for if they're going to be on the anti-natal ward without their partner and say, download the Frayer app. Um, it's not quite as good as the real thing, but it's a great second. Yeah.

Speaker 1:

Oh my goodness. No, that sounds incredible. Especially when your county, like you're saying the surges contractions and stuff like that, you know, to be able to try and relay that information to a health professional last year in the throws of giving birth is probably not something that you've, you're solely focused on, but to have something to hand like that, I think that's a fantastic plan plan B I have to be honest because my husband would probably drive me crazy. So it'd probably be like, no Freya has got me for the next few hours. You can wait outside, but yeah, I'd say it's a good second best. I mean,

Speaker 4:

It might just be the best. Yeah. You know, let's, let's not rule it out completely here.

Speaker 1:

No, but that sounds, um, that's incredible. And so when you're, I mean, with all these techniques and everything that you've developed, um, is it, I imagine you've got quite a team behind you, you have specialists that have helped build this kind of body of knowledge and work that you're able to put in practice.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. We work with, um, uh, uh, yeah, as we've grown, we work with a lot of different people on various different projects, um, which is really wonderful. So over the lockdown, we ran something called the unwind series, for example, which was, um, every single evening at 9:00 PM, we went live with a relaxation session. Um, and we did that for a month and all of those sessions are still on our YouTube channel if anybody wants to revisit them. So we had, um, you know, a breathwork workshops, guided meditation soundbites, um, lots of different, um, polo, not parties, yoga. Sorry. Um, so yeah, we, we work with all of those kinds of experts. Um, so whenever we work on a new project, we kind of recruit the people that we need. So yeah, that's really, really nice part of the job.

Speaker 1:

Fantastic. I suppose it again, just to reiterate what you said earlier that it's, you know, it's based in science, it's based with specialists and experts and it's, um, and you're just kind of providing a body of information and resource for all of these, you know, the parents about to kind of embark on this in what we've just said is it's just such an extraordinary, challenging time. Um, I think a massive high high five has to go out to anybody who's given birth during the pandemic, because what an extraordinary thing to say, you know, years to come of going, oh yeah, that's, that's what I did, you know, kind of thing. Um, and obviously this is a lot of, we've really focusing obviously on that before work of, you know, and really preparing the minds and, you know, a lot of exercise, a lot of stuff like that, a concentration on the, before birth is techniques and things that you would recommend, uh, for the postpartum, you know, the after.

Speaker 3:

Yes. So we have, um, actually got a post-partum pack, which is a, um, online course for afterwards, which we developed purely because the community asked us to, so we had our digital pack was I hypnobirthing program. And the feedback that we had in that first year was it's excellent. I went into birth feeling really informed. I had an amazing birth experience. And then I came home and had no idea what I was doing because so much of the focus is on, you know, in pregnancy, on preparing for birth, but actually what about afterwards? And then, you know, I didn't feel confident and I didn't feel informed. So, um, we heard that feedback all time. So we created the postpartum pack, which is a series of seven different workshops. And again, what we cover in the workshops is what came from the community. You ask them what they most wish they'd known more about. So we have a workshop on feeding, which covers breastfeeding and bottle feeding and expressing. We have infant sleep. We have maternal mental health. We have physical recovery from[inaudible] birth and vaginal birth. We have a relationship, um, expert counts, life coach, and counselor, doing a workshop on overcoming relationship challenges because obviously relationships change once the dynamic is different with new, with a new baby into the mix. And then we have a wellbeing workshop as well with a lovely, uh, yoga and meditation session. So, sorry. So we created all of that in, in sort of response to our community, saying that they wanted that support postnatally. We also have this really active, um, postpartum community as well, which is really, really wonderful. Um, and it's kind of like a forum that we have, and yeah, so we have that kind of support, but also we produce a lot of free resources as well, which we tend to share on our YouTube channel. So especially during the lockdown period, we've been aware that services have been, uh, you know, not so accessible for new moms. So we've had, um, hypnobirthing master classes. We've had breastfeeding workshops, um, both antenatal and postnatal, breastfeeding workshops, and those are all available to watch for free on our YouTube channel as well. So we're always kind of listening and responding quite quickly to our community and creating what they, what they're asking for.

Speaker 1:

That's absolutely incredible because, you know, obviously like we were saying, you know, everything's sort of geared to the, the labor, the events of the giving birth. And the one thing that I found quite, um, I don't know what the word is, but I found quite, uh, interesting. I don't know, again, this is probably not the right word to use, but a lot of my friends I'd say probably maybe two, three months after they've had their baby things start settling back down to normality or a sense of, you know, externally what might seem like normal, happy, new little family. It would be probably maybe even a year later they would come and say, I've never felt more lonely. I, and that's where the real kind of, I don't know if you know, it's the tired nurse, it's, it's a completely new experience. All of a sudden, you're, you know, you're the mother of a tiny human and you've got to keep it alive, you know, and you've got all that stress and strain and maybe your partner's going back to work. And then all of a sudden you're on your own. And I think, you know, when women really get behind women, especially like on a community forum and stuff like that. So I think it's fantastic. You've got so many like-minded women that are felt confident in what you do and have been able to kind of really go like, this is a safe place I'm going to talk about. I actually need a bit more extra help and that this, this has been built up around that. Cause I know it's, um, it's almost something that maybe women are a bit of shamed to admit after getting better. They might not be handling it very well. Like, well, they, you know, they're just adapting, uh, which is totally, totally understandable. So I always think it's, um, it's always that after part that I think is always so important as well. It's amazing you guys kind of cater for that continued care.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. It's so important and you're right. You know, there's so much pressure that women put on themselves. You know, you want to look, you know, to be keeping the house tidy and got baby, and everyone's happy, you know, this meant to be your happiest time of your life. And actually it can be really, really hard and you're, you're learning new things that you've never done before, coupled with huge responsibility for this, what seems very fragile baby, that you care so greatly about on very little sleep often with very little support. So, you know, it is a very challenging time and, um, yeah, and, and women typically will put a lot of pressure on themselves. So that can be really difficult. And especially with lockdown in the pandemic and not being able to go out to meet others and seek that support, you know, peer support that would usually be readily available. Um, so yes, it's been a really difficult time, but we do have, yeah, those groups, those supportive non-judgemental groups that we have are incredible spaces and, you know, going on there and seeing the support that women are offering other women is amazing. And we've heard so many times that people say the course was worth the money just for that group, you know, just for the access to that private group afterwards, because they have had so much benefit from that. So we do try to foster that in our communities.

Speaker 1:

I think that's, that is just so fundamental and so important. Um, I've also seen that you, uh, you guys have partnered with five or more, um, campaign, which is about five times more apologies about raising awareness on, uh, maternal disparities for women in the UK. Can you tell me a little bit, bit more about the work that you guys are, are doing for that?

Speaker 3:

Sure. So the five times more campaign, um, is yeah, really important campaign raising awareness, um, and, um, and campaigning for change when it comes to the mortality rates between black women and white women in the UK. So, um, black women are currently five times more likely to die in childbirth and postnatally than white women. So there's a huge racial disparity there. So they are campaigning one to raise awareness to, to understand the disparity and why that exists. And three campaigning for change for that gap can be closed. Um, and that's something, you know, we've always said positive birth company. We want to make, you know, a positive birth experience accessible for all. Um, and really it was in the light in light of the black lives matter movement that we really became more acutely aware of how actually your, how the different factors that actually prevent women from being able to have that positive birth experience and that racial disparity and that, and that gap, um, in maternal mortality rates, which is so serious, actually something we hadn't, hadn't done something to address. So we're very honored to be able to partner with five times more to support that campaign. Um, and we do that in a number of ways. So we recently sponsored an event that they ran. We, um, try to, we work with their community to distribute our online course for free to, um, black women. We distribute a hundred packs a month. Um, I mean, it's not going to solve the problem, but again, part of our mission to make that education more accessible. So women feel more empowered and confident going into birth and know their options and able to kind of speak up for themselves. Um, yeah, and we, we actually, in-house self, we use members of the PBC team to, um, create artwork and stuff like that as well for the campaign.

Speaker 1:

That's yeah, no, that's an incredible stat. Um, like you just say that, you know, that's insane and that should be everywhere. You know what I mean? That should be on the news. And I think it's so, like you're saying, I think it's just, you know, it's raising the education, it's raising our awareness and really broadening it out because it's, um, there shouldn't be any difference it's women, you know, and it's maybe giving birth and it's making that journey, um, as seamless and as memorable. And, you know, um, like you say, as such a positive experience, um, and not, they shouldn't be any disparity between one woman's experience to another.

Speaker 3:

It's really scary. And, and then little has been done within the healthcare system so far, you know, uh, up until recently to actually address that it's quite scary, but, um, the five times more team are doing wonderful things and making real headway. So they had a petition, which they wanted to get a hundred thousand signatures and they well exceeded that. Um, then they've recently partnered with the world college of obstetricians and gynecologists, and they've produced, um, five steps that, um, healthcare professionals as well can take to ensure that black women understand stand everything and listened to, um, and everything that should be happening anyway, but really kind of, um, solidifying that and making that known within the healthcare community as well. So they are making huge headway.

Speaker 1:

That's incredible. And just to kind of finish off, obviously, you know, hypnobirthing is becoming more and more, um, no within, you know, sort of the kind of public domain, like people are becoming more aware of this as a, a really good alternative to just, uh, what we've known of what a birth experience should be WIC. Where would you like to see it say in like 10 years,

Speaker 3:

I'd like it to be available through the NHS. And so that every single woman in the UK, every single person that's giving birth in the UK gets to do a hypnobirthing course. That would be the dream because it makes such a massive difference in not just, not just emotionally and psychologically, but also if women are more confident, they're more likely to choose birth centers over labor wards. Um, intervention rates are statistically a lot lower for birth centers. So there's better outcomes for moms and babies also will save the NHS money because lower intervention, which would do that. So, I mean, there's just benefits for everybody, um, you know, mentally, physically, and also, um, cost when it comes to the NHS. So yeah, my dream would be that everybody gets to do a hypnosis of course.

Speaker 1:

No, absolutely. Absolutely. And I think it's, um, uh, yeah, it should definitely be available as an option, you know? So you're given the whole kind of banquet of things that you there, like you say, it's just all about making an informed decision that's right for you and just being equipped for when the data does come. And I'm sure with you behind the Hills Hills on this side, you'll be pushing, I say, 10 years, should we say, should I give you five

Speaker 3:

That's where we're working, that's what we're working towards.

Speaker 1:

No, absolutely. And I think, you know, the pandemic has been such an odd time and it continues to be so broken. It is kind of really been an amazing time to raise these sort of these voices across a number of different fields. Um, and you know, this is, you know, especially with maternity in the wards, um, on and on the news has been really coming up with light, but not, um, but not maternity campaigns, everything like that. It's really bringing spotlights on certain areas across the board. Um, so I think, you know, now's a, an amazing time to really kind of, you know, get everybody's voices to join in and really kind of bang, bang this drum because I think it's, it's such an important thing. Yeah. Brilliant stuff. So, final question for you. What does parent hood mean to you? Oh God, what is parenting?

Speaker 4:

So I finish off with a really broad question mean to me. Oh my goodness. I don't even know

Speaker 3:

How to answer that. So it could, and on what day, jeez. On what day it would be different each day. Parenthood mean to me,

Speaker 1:

Brilliant answer by the way, which day. I mean, some

Speaker 3:

Days it like brings me to my knees and some days it's the most joy, you know, being a mom to my three boys is yeah. It's the highest of the highs and the lowest of the lows I think, and everything in between. Yeah. But

Speaker 1:

I don't have kids. You can tell[inaudible],

Speaker 4:

I feel

Speaker 3:

Like that's been a really bad answer, but, um, no, I, I mean, I love being a mom and, um, I would love to have another baby and I've already got three, so it's the greatest, it's the greatest.

Speaker 1:

Yeah. I think that, well, that's almost like perfect advocacy right there. That doesn't have to be no,

Speaker 3:

If I could give birth tomorrow, I would absolutely do that. Like in a heartbeat. Like I, I feel envious of people that are about to give birth because it's just the most incredible experience. And, um, I think it's something I actually should have said earlier, as well as that, you know, we're talking about misconceptions around what hypnobirthing is. You know, people often think that positive birth is an intervention free birth, you know, a water birth or home birth. That's a positive birth, but actually all births have the potential to be positive because it's not the mechanics of how the birth happens. That dictates whether the experience was positive or not. But actually it's how the mother felt during the experience that dictates whether it was positive or not. So whether you're having a straightforward water birth or you're having a more complicated birth experience where[inaudible] birth, all of those births can feel positive. If you're informed about your options, you feel calm, you feel in control, you feel respected, you feel listened to, you know, every single birth has a potential to be a really magical moment for you that you'll remember for the rest of your life.

Speaker 1:

That's not on a t-shirt, that's incredible. But I think that's, that is, that is such an amazing few words just to leave our listeners with, um, because I think that's the whole thing, isn't it, it's just how, how you approach it and how you walk away from the experience. And, uh, and you know, with, with the positive birth company, being able to provide you with those tools and that education to be able to do it. Um, thank you so much, Shavasana, it's been an absolute pleasure talking to you and I've, I've, I've, I've learned a huge amount and I, I, you know, I'm sure our listeners have gained a huge amount of knowledge and understanding from, from this. And we'll be heading over to your website and be having a little look at your online digital courses. And, um, just familiarizing, because like you say, you're on YouTube. You're, you've got Instagram and Facebook. Well,

Speaker 3:

Yeah. All at the positive birth company, we have so many free resources as well. So, you know, going to a YouTube channel or Instagram or IETV, we have so many free resources. So I would encourage anybody who's listening, who's pregnant or has a new baby to, you know, go check us out on those social platforms because you don't need to spend any money to actually be able to hopefully find something that benefits you.

Speaker 1:

No fantastic. That's well, that's wonderful. Thank you so much for, and um, yeah, it's been an absolute pleasure chatting to you and have a lovely

Speaker 4:

Day enjoy parenthood.

Speaker 3:

It's okay. Thank you. Bye bye.

Speaker 1:

To find out more information on the positive birth company and the amazing work they are doing head to the eye-candy blog page at www dot eye candy, world.com forward slash icy life, where you'll find all the relevant links to the social pages that we've mentioned in today's podcast. I count as a proud supporter of great Ormond street children's hospital charity. COVID 19 means the hospital is facing new challenges and needs more support than ever to continue the life changing care and researched for seriously ill children. If you are able to support, gosh, please head to our dedicated fundraising page on www dot, just giving.com forward slash company four slash icon.